Some years back, I had written an editorial for The Air Force Times. Well, this article went a little viral, featuring on John Q. Public's page. (John Q. is a popular online critic of the Air Force and a former Lieutenant Colonel).
Fast forward a few years. Today, I had found out that the person I wrote about wrote a book, and in that book it mentioned me and my writing piece. I've learned to celebrate small successes as a yet-to-be-traditionally-published author, and one of my dreams was to be mentioned in another relatively prominent writer's book. So, naturally, this is a happy event for me. However...
I'm curious to know why I wasn't notified. Are there any permissions that should be obtained on his end? I should also mention it was properly referenced in the back of the book.
Don't get me wrong, I'm happy as heck to find this out and am not going to do anything but rejoice, but now I'm wondering if my works are mentioned or referenced in other books. After all, you did tell me once that permissions must be sought by the copyright owner before use. Which I suppose raises a secondary question: If I write an editorial to a newspaper and it gets printed, does the newspaper own the copyright or do I? Cheers!
Permission is required to quote from your work in chunks longer than a sentence or two (generally.)
Permission is NOT required to refer to you and your work.
Example:
If I want to collect and publish a selection of blog contest entries, like this one from Kitty,
“And then she saw Catherine Higgins, Mrs. Platt said, after she hit her with her vehicle,” said the officer.
“Ms. Higgins said nothing’s broken, it was an accident and she won’t press charges,” said the Chief. “Thank God that sweet old lady was driving slow and doesn’t know Arthur is seeing Ms. Higgins.”
Later, Arthur told his wife, “That Buick is simply too big. You can’t see over the steering wheel.”
“I can see just fine.”
“You need a smaller car.”
“Arthur?”
“Yes, Dear?”
“Stop seeing Catherine or next time I’ll gun that Buick. This time I only stunned her.”
I will need Kitty's permission to use the entire entry.
I could quote just the last line, most likely, and call it fair use.
I will NOT need her permission to say "Kitty's entry about Mrs. Platt and the Buick cracked me up."
In all instances, I will need to cite where Kitty's entry can be found, so that other readers can see the original source and make sure I'm not misquoting, or bowdlerizing Kitty's entry.
This reminds me of the gent in Maryland who wanted to preclude a newspaper reporter from writing about him without his permission. Of course, since he was an elected official, he was pretty roundly ridiculed for not understanding the basics of the first amendment. While you are not a public figure or a politician, if you write about someone, it's not a big leap to assume they in turn might reference the work.
If you think about this, you'll see that requiring permission to talk about an author's work would stifle any kind of free discussion, academic analysis, and most of this blog. A calamity in the making!
In addition, a writer can quote from a work without needing permission if the quote falls under Fair Use. The rules for that are too complex for this blog post, but generally think short in length and scholarly in purpose.
As for letters to the editor, I just don't know. Most likely that would be covered in the newspaper's terms of use.
52 comments:
OP: If you want to know who else might have mentioned or cited your work, Google can be useful. To see if you're referenced in scholarly works, go to scholar.google.com. Search for your article. Locate your article in the results list, and click "Cited by…" to see a list of other publications that cited your work.
To see if any other books reference it, go to books.google.com. Search for your article. The search results should be books containing the word or phrase you searched on. To optimize your results, make sure your search is fairly distinctive. I would recommend searching the article title enclosed in quotation marks. You might also throw in your last name to make it more distinctive.
Of course, both of these strategies are limited to sources indexed by Google, but nowadays, that's almost everything. With Google Books, works that are still in copyright will not be available in full text, but you can still search them.
You might be pleased to know that Arthur Platt has stopped his tomcatting ways. Apparently the women about town will give Arthur nothing more than a polite ‘good day’ as long as Mrs. Platt is still merrily maneuvering her Buick about town.
Over the years I've had hundreds of articles, op-eds and columns in the newspapers. Back when Jesus was in diapers it was always my understanding that the papers would send me a galley, I'd make changes, or simply approve, and they get to publish it one time. Often the pieces were edited lightly without galleys and that was okay. There were only two times it went beyond borders because of the wire service. (I felt famous).
Now, my columns are regularly shared on FB, emailed by readers to readers and friends, and I have no way of knowing how much and where my words might be used.
I'd love to know but in today's world that would be pretty impossible, unless something I wrote went viral. (A girl can dream.)
THANK you, Kitty for that sequel. haha...
And, more good information to know. I used extensive quotes in my non-fiction book and needed to get permissions. My small press publisher/editor guided me in this process.
I have hundreds of thousands of articles floating around out there. Pieces of them have been reprinted as fair use. Who knows, entire ones may be.
I've been acknowledged in four books. Two authors asked beforehand. Two surprised me.
Accept it and be happy. Congratulations.
Of course, for blog articles that are linked by others, you should get a ping-back telling you such-and-such has linked to your amazing piece of online wisdom. Print works are different. My cousin's husband teaches church history at a college here in the US. Some years back when I was studying for my M.Div., I came across a reference to book he'd written (his published Ph.D. dissertation, I think) in another scholar's work. Of course, I passed that on to my Mum, and she sent the news on down the family chain (big Irish family--no news is new for long). I don't think my cousin's husband (cousin-in-law?) was even aware that he had been cited, though he knew the author who cited him.
Janet, if someone does reference one of your client's works in such a way they think they ought to get permission, who would they reach out to first: your client, you, or the publisher? I presume the request would pass through you at some point so you can vet the request (protecting your client's interests and all that).
Good question, Opie! And congrats for the recognition of your work. A success worth celebrating. :)
I am not sleeping much so forgive me if the following question makes no sense. So, say a periodical wanted to publish Kitty's hilarious flash fiction piece, would they need our queen's blessing or Kitty's or both?
Legal matters, like permissions and wills, makes the buzzing insects in my brain go beserk so I can't hold on to it. I probably signed away my first born years ago but have no idea when or why. I know I need to be aware of this stuff but like I said- buzzing insects in the brain. Another reason I need a supercalifragilistic agent.
There is a good article on the Graphic Artist Guild website which explains fair use.
https://graphicartistsguild.org/tools_resources/what-is-fair-use
I've been following this because right now in France there is a big stink about the fair use policy on the internet in regards to artists and writer's rights. The government wants to give more freedom to exploit creative works without acknowledgement. The Maison des Artistes and the AGESSA are battling this stupid decision. The AGESSA governs writers, illustrators and printed words while the Maison des Artists governs painters sculptors and the like.
E.M., the agent needs the "expialidocious" part as well, other wise the "super" part is negated. :)
OP, this was a great question. There is a quote in DIXIE DUPREE from a well known authority on X subject. (X = spoiler). It's not till the end of the book, but QOTKU's answer here will enable me to DELETE the "draft" email I've held on to for months in anticipation of letting said authority know I was using something they wrote as a quote. It's one sentence, and if I'm reading this correctly, it falls under Fair Use as it's out on her own website. I hope I'm interpreting this correctly.
Either way, OP, congratulations that your work has been cited/referenced and obviously thought much of for someone to include it! I think it's time for a little celebratory event for yourself!
Donna, I quite realize but I simply lacked the fortitude to get the whole word down. I lost a battle with commas, italics, and exclamation points at 2 am and had to be at work at 6:30 am. I knew the Reef would get my meaning and carry it over the finish line. Thanks, Donna :)
Sing along with me...
Supercalafragelisticexpialiagent
Even though to say the word will make you sound contagent
If you say it loud enough you'll never fear a plagiarent
Supercalafragelisticexpialiagent
:D
Where it gets really crazy, as I understand copyright law/policy, is with song lyrics, where only very, very short segments, or the title, can get referenced without permission, except that that is nearly impossible to get. And so what then about a song who’s title is also part of the lyrics such as “I’m leaving on a… (ack, Very short!)) And if that’s not bad enough, what about songs written by someone (say John Denver) but popularized by another (say Peter, Paul, and Mary.)
Better to just rip all those lyrics out and write all original music. Tommy Wallace did that with ‘We All Looked Up,’ a great book with an all original playlist composed and sung by the author. Wow.
Colin! Brilliant. Plagiarant should definitely become a word.
Robert--I'm so glad you brought up "We All Looked Up"! I asked Tommy about his process here, and it was very informative...
Almost forgot... Angie's link: https://graphicartistsguild.org/tools_resources/what-is-fair-use
Thanks, Karen! I just couldn't resist... ;)
Thank you for the ear worm dear Colin. I'm going on my run now with umdiddleliddleliddelumdiddlelie ringing in my head. :)
E.M., coffee might not do the trick today, eh? I could NOT function, much less put together a cohesive comment on four hours sleep. You're duly excused.
All this talk about coffee is making me thirsty. Luckily, I have a coffee maker in my office. :)
That linked article reminded me of the 'right to be forgotten' case in the EU. John Oliver did a hilarious segment on it - but it makes me wonder about celebrities or public officials in the EU, and if they could get results pertaining to them off of Google.
Sorry for the off-topic thought. Here, let me just grab some coffee.
Mmmmmm.
It is always a good idea to ask. If you can make it a habit. There is no telling how people will react if a friend says you used something of theirs.
Of course most people will not bother to give you their permission. I don't think this is very often a malicious thing. Generally it has to do with answering emails from people you do not know. "Permission requested" as a subject line might also cause an adverse reaction to many who have had phishing emails come their way before.
Coffee and belly laugh via Colin- I might not be awake or coherent or capable of small motor functions, but I am happier. I still don't comprehend the permissions thing but hoping for that well-fanged scrumdiliuncous agent to help one day. If I ever finish this rewrite.
I didn't mean to stay up so late- I got sucked into the black hole of editing a 130,000 word manuscript. I thought it was still around 10 PM when I shut down. It was 2. My pug laughed at me when she woke me at 5:30. Writing will do that.
Did you see the kerfuffle on Twitter yesterday, where a tweet by Lauren DeStefano(nytba) was plagiarized by someone else, and that someone else got quoted by major news networks? Lauren was NOT happy. She asked people to help her track down all the re-tweets and quotes, and let them know the origin of the tweet. Everyone they found apologized and re-credited the quotation. The plagiarist, however, is unrepentant. "It's only a Tweet, it's not like it's a novel" is what her defenders say. Lauren says it doesn't matter. Those were her words, and someone else stole them and claimed them for herself. That's theft. I'm with Lauren on that one. Even if you don't ask permission to quote a tweet, have the courtesy to credit the person who created the original.
Great Q and A today. I remember how time consuming and costly it was to secure permissions for the photos I used in my book. I can't imagine what it would have been like to notify the authors I mentioned in the book. This is why scholars use citations--that's where the credit is given. Beth's advice for keeping tabs on this is very helpful.
Karen, thanks for the link and the article. One thing I love is authors helping authors, especially deserving authors. But rats, now I have another book to buy (talk about helping authors!)
>>In addition, a writer can quote from a work without needing permission if the quote falls under Fair Use. The rules for that are too complex for this blog post, but generally think short in length and scholarly in purpose.
Fair Use is a heavily-litigated subject. Just consider the recent Authors Guild v Google lawsuit, which took 10 years and ended with the decision that Google's indexing of every word of millions of books is a fair use
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authors_Guild,_Inc._v._Google,_Inc.
Here's a summary page of fair use cases
http://fairuse.stanford.edu/overview/fair-use/cases/
Which leads me to the point of this comment.
>>Apparently unhappy with Rodgers' reply, Delauter issued a threat: "Use my name again unauthorized and you'll be paying for an attorney. Your rights stop where mine start."
This quote from The Atlantic article Janet linked, regarding an elected official threatening a newspaper reporter with a lawsuit [can anyone say First Amendment?], makes a good point. Just because you are right, and you win any lawsuit brought against you, your “win” may not necessarily make you feel all warm and fuzzy. It can cost $100,000+ to defend a copyright/fair use lawsuit, even if you win. Your lawyer, on the other hand, has remodeled his mansion and booked an around-the-world cruise for the summer [can anyone say Dena practices in the wrong area of the law?].
And especially if you are making money [or trying to] from what you wrote, be sure it's your OWN words, or you have written permission.
Be smart and be warned.
Dena's links:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authors_Guild,_Inc._v._Google,_Inc.
http://fairuse.stanford.edu/overview/fair-use/cases/
Colin, I saw that yesterday and sided with Lauren. Using someone's words as your own is never the right way to go. If it's just a tweet ... shouldn't be that hard to write your own, now should it? Or simply tap that RT button Twitter so kindly provided.
My favorite cases of plagiarism in my classes are the ones where students copy and paste from the internet but forget to remove hyperlinks.
I may try scholar.google.com when I have time.
My published writings (under my name or under a judge’s name) are law related. I can recall only one time that anyone sought my permission to reprint part of an article (I think it ended up being five or six pages in a real estate casebook). The rest of the time I found them by accident or through a Westlaw search.
I wrote earlier this year how the Alabama Supreme Court in January quoted four or five paragraphs from an affidavit I submitted (they introduced it with “As Professor Snoe explained in his well reasoned analysis” – yay).
My first year of teaching was as a visitor at a law school in Chicago. One day I was talking to a professor who was writing a casebook on ERISA. I started telling him about an opinion I wrote on ERISA. He told me to come to his office. He opened his galley pages to where he had excerpted two paragraphs from the opinion.
You got me reminiscing now. And I’m enjoying it too much. I better stop.
I had to deal with permissions for various materials for my textbook. There was one passage I wanted to use from another book, consisting of a couple of short paragraphs, but the copyright holder refused to grant permissions. I wound up paraphrasing the message and quoting just one pithy sentence, which was allowed under fair use (with complete citations and a full reference at the end, of course). Over the years I've attended various workshops on the copyright principles of "fair use" aimed at educators, and the one statement I remember most vividly is that it depends on so many factors, the only way to know for sure whether something falls under fair use is to stand before a judge in a courtroom and get a ruling. As a result, I've been VERY conservative in what I use, even in the classroom. I also make sure to teach all my students one basic fact: Just because something has been posted on the Internet does NOT mean it's in the public domain. You don't have the right to copy it, even with a correct citation. This blows their minds.
Of course, I'm talking here about actually copying material. Simply referring to something or someone is allowed under free speech, as long as it's not libel or hate speech and as long as credit for ideas is given properly. At least, that's my understanding (insert here the usual caveat about me not being a lawyer).
Carolynnwith2Ns
I didn't write but I was quoted in a news story that was published all over the world (A man buried his wife's corpse in his front yard; and the city demanded he remove it) and I even saw a picture and link to it on my msn.com for a few days. Got a good laugh out of that.
I even received two long distance phone calls from people seeking legal help from that one. (The best I could for either one was lend a sympathetic ear and encourage them to see a lawyer near them)
This is Julie
Most letters to the editors have it spelled out that they become the property of the paper. You agree to this when you submit a letter. You also agree to allow them to edit if they so choose.
As I said once before, my previous editor once had a profile she'd done on a famous stallion lifted verbatim by a well known stud farm for their advertising brochures. They said they didn't need to pay her because the piece had already been published. Her lawyers convinced them, yes they did. So, they had to pull several thousands of dollars worth of advertising due to not receiving permission and them deciding they were going to be bullheaded and not pay her. This screwed up a season's worth of advertising as you need to promote your stallions well ahead of breeding season, which in the racing world is a relatively short season.
The OP should be happy for the good press.
(ninja posting on my son's account and I wasn't sure how it would show up. He will be so happy to know he is remarking on a writer's site. Yay Will!)
I'm not sure why people ever deny usage with proper citations. As Oscar Wilde said,
"The only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about."
Beth
Scholar.google.com was a fun trip. I found cites I didn’t know about to casebooks, law reviews, The American Law Institute and others.
My biggest laugh came from two articles in the "Academic Journal of Suzhou University." The entries were in Chinese.
The books.google.com wasn’t as useful. There are books listed there that in no way could reference anything I wrote. One that did cite my co-authored book is titled “Is Eating People Wrong?” I hope it’s a thin book.
Joseph Snoe, I'm glad Google Scholar was useful! "Is Eating People Wrong?" just gave me a good chuckle.
"Is Eating People Wrong?" I think I saw that book on Carkoon. If I recall, the author's conclusion was it depends on the sauce.
Now I'm probably going to get in trouble by talking about legal things. So I will say right now: I am not a lawyer of any sort. I just read a lot about copyright and such. Nothing I say can be remotely considered legal advice.
Donna: I'd run that quote past your publisher first, to see what they prefer. As Janet said, one sentence *should* be fine, but your publisher may have a more specific policy. In legal matters, if there's a chance of interpreting something incorrectly, it's best to get more specific advice from someone. And don't forget to cite the source at the back of the book!
As Janet says, 'fair use' is pretty complicated. Only a court can definitively decide if something is fair use or not. The question is not, "Is this fair use?" The question is, "Would a court of law find this to be fair use?" And another question to ask is, "Would the owner of the copyright bother suing me, even if the court would find in my favour?" These court cases can get expensive, for both sides. (As Dena said.)
I'm sure publishers have policies to make this simpler for them and their authors, based on their own legal experts' advice. So ask them.
Robert Ceres: When it comes to songs, the cover artists are rarely the owners of the copyright. You want to find the actual owner of the copyright. And titles cannot be copyrighted.
The reason only very short segments of songs can be referenced without permission is that songs are very short, compared to novels. I don't know if there are exact percentages that are legal, but while 25 words might be a pittance in a 90,000 word novel, it could be as much as 25% of a song. Heck, 25 words is more than 'Happy Birthday', and that's been in contention for years (I think it's finally been decided, but I don't know if there have been any appeals filed.)
Regarding the plagiarized tweet: That's 100% of the tweet. I *believe* tweets are as protected as any other expression, but if my memory serves (and it rarely does) I think this sort of thing is still being decided in courts.
Excellent advice, BJ Muntain
I use four lines from "Waltzing Matilda 'in my WIP. I've researched it over and over again to be sure the lyrics are in public domain, but it still makes
me nervous.
Beth and Colin, didn't Hannibal Lecter pen that song, "If eating people is wrong, I don't want to be right"?
Yes, Colin I saw that tome during my sojourn on Carkoon. Is Eating People Wrong was under the Kale Existential Literary section at Lima Bean Books (which I believe burned down in a tragic kale and soy vodka distillery experiment). Anyhow, the Carkoon population while espousing a strict vegetarian diet makes an exception for eating people who have become vegetables. There is indeed a sauce and a special processing procedure. This is why I never ordered the "Blood Vegetable Stew". *shudders*
Joseph: I believe it was on the same album as, "People... people who eat people... are the yummiest people in the world" :)
I'm not saying my experience is the correct way to approach the issue, but that won't stop me from sharing it. I wanted to reference a certain ghostly book in my middle grade manuscript. I think my use is covered by fair use, but I wanted to cover my bases. After considerable research I started the process with the publisher to get permission. But, I had also reached out to the author who eagerly invited me to reference her book in any way I chose. (I'm sure she looked at my accounts linked in my email to prove I wasn't a robot.) just saying, the publisher had a million hoops, and the author eager excitement! I'm hoping author okay is enough.
BJ, the quote has been part of the ms since day one. After thinking about it more, it's really no different than any other quote in a book...i.e. it's there in italics, with quotation marks, and the person who wrote it named as the source.
My guess is, if this were an issue the publisher would have said, "you got approval to use that?" They've never even mentioned it, and it's in the ARC and ready to go to print.
*Don't make me hyperventilate while I'm on the rodent wheel here. :)
I went back to some emails when DIXIE was in editing stage under Kensington...and from editor in reference to the design/style sheet for DIXIE DUPREE, he said, "Please note you can only use ONE line from a song (or another source) without permission."
Good for me I only one line from a Beatles song in the book. This would seem to be the answer in regard to the quote I use at the end as well. (i.e. his mention of "other source.")
I used three lines from Lord Byron's The Giaour in Rain Crow. In the scene the author was doing the blue pencil on the character was recalling the poem and Lord Byron's lines.
I thought he brought it up because it might be a problem, but he just thought it was an interesting play off the aftermath of the battle scene to use the lines. Now, I suppose I should do some double checking.
I don't start off my day on the hamster wheel, but a trip to Janet's blog will get me there.
Great info as usual. It just occurred to me in reading the comments that I do quote from a (rather old) song in my WIP, and I quote TWO lines. The manuscript is far enough from publication that it doesn't really matter yet, but I have now officially flagged this item in my mind. Come to think of it, maybe the quote would read better as one line in any case...
I never miss reading JR blog but I did missed yesterday's blog and interrobang exchange. But better late than never, I guess.
I have been using (not over-using) this method below:
INTERROBANGS for dummies (and mac users...not necessarily interchangeable)
On Mac OS X – after typing a ? (or any symbol) you want to turn into an interrobang, try this, select the '?' then try this : An interrobang (suitable for internet writing) can be found on the 'Character Palette', it will pop up in your comment form by pressing (and holding briefly) the keyboard combination of: control+option(aka alt)+spacebar at the same time.
This will show you your keyboard characters (and a bunch of emojis), look in the upper right, there is a little character box, click and it will expand to a bigger, more complete character box. Go to 'punctuation' and find the interrobang. You can double-click on the '‽' and it will replace the '?' into your comment. This can also work when you are querying the QOTKU too...if you are sending it by email.
Sorry, but I only really know MAC, PC is a foreign language I haven't mastered and probably never will. I do know that all fonts like Arial, Lucinda, Palantino and Times New Roman have one hidden in them – if you can find them.
(Colin, you could add this to your glossary ‽)
Kate: Thankfully for the rest of the universe, I am not the curator of the glossary (who knows what funky words would end up there). All glossary addition requests must be made to Mighty QOTKU Herself.
BTW, I'm pleased to see NORMAN made the list. Thanks, Ms. Shark! :)
Lauren's tweet fiasco kind of reminds me of Martha Brockenbrough's situation. She wrote a letter to her daughter about Santa Clause, that was reprinted in the NYT in 2009. Sometime after that, someone rewrote her letter but changed the gender of the child questioning the existence of Santa, and also added a bunch of stuff about religion. It went viral. To this day, Martha will receive snide messages and comments about her copying the religious-themed letter.
Scholastic is publishing a picture book version of Martha's letter, so she's having the last laugh. But I feel sorry that she has to deal with this. It seems like a lot of people see things on the internet as being copyright-free/fair-use, and it's so unfair to photographers/writers/etc whose work is stolen.
Here's Martha's letter in the NYT
Sorry if this shows up twice. I think I made a mistake in my first attempt to comment.
I didn't have time to read through all the comments today, so forgive me if someone has already mentioned this. But this "Fair Use" idea isn't universal. If you are quoting or using works copyrighted outside of the USA, it's best to check with the laws of that country. Legal tentacles can reach across the sea.
I say this as someone who included in my manuscript song excerpts and quotes from works by Italian authors and composers, and discovered that Italian copyright law views Fair Use rather differently, and also includes esoteric notions like "moral rights".
Before you ask, yes, this resulted in an epic re-write and search for works in the public domain (note that the timeline for entry into the public domain also varies by country), as well as a successful attempt at obtaining permission for only one of the quotes.
My only experience is with Italian law, but it may also apply in other countries, so best to be aware of that.
Trust me, the last thing you want to become intimately acquainted with is the Italian legal system. Mamma Mia!
Kitty,
I thought this was odd, but now it's starting to make sense. I was at a downtown diner the other day and commented on how nice Arthur Platt is looking these days.
Then, yesterday, a big ol' Buick pulled up on the sidewalk in front of me and a kindly woman leaned out the window. My path cut off, I had to give her my full attention.
"Sorry," she said. "When I drive near your house, sometimes I mistake the gas pedal for the brake." Without another word, or a response from me, she was off.
I watched her drive perfectly down the road, flip on her indicator and navigate a smooth left turn.
I might go say Hi to Catherine Higgins who seems lonely these days, but you won't find me near Arthur Platt. (Not that there's anything wrong with that.)
John,
You know, some days I keep up perfectly well. Other days I feel like I've been dropped into the middle of a Twilight Zone episode. I'm just going to back away slowly.
Julie: Backing away slowly won't save you from Mrs. Platt, if you get too close to Arthur...
BJ,
Niiiiiice. Beat me to the punch.
Julie,
My characters got tired of me and threw me out, so I decided to play with Kitty's imaginary friends for a spell. Which might be a Twilight Zone episode for all I know.
Day 7 of feeling like death warmed up. My brain is fog and my nose rivals Rudolph's. So apologies if anything I say sounds like I've spent the last month on Carkoon.
Miss Janet, how do differences in laws around the world affect fair use? What is deemed fair use in America might not be the same in Australia so do you go by the country the originator of the works live in, or the country in which the works will be published?
Would this than affect those in US re First Amendment in the same way?
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